“Holy potatoes” 🤣🤣🤣🤣💀💀💀
TIL that the Dom Guy’s name is Jeremy, apparently.
Just take the train!
Instead of rescuing Jason Bourne, they blow a hole in the planet. Brilliant!! 🤣
This one is brilliant! XD
Going off on a tangent here, I dislike it when people use that phrase “Jesus Christ!” like that. I get that religion has caused much of the evil in this world… (arguably less so than capitalism but… whatever!:-P), though that doesn’t (shouldn’t) matter. It demeans us to sink to that level, whatever our own personal thoughts are on the matter, and regardless of the particular target. / end of my Ted Talk here
And like, isn’t that the meaning of Rule 1, where generally “othering” a group is a strong no-no (the chief one in fact, hence it appearing first)? Granted that religion is a choice unlike e.g. race or sexual preference, but even so? Jesus himself was an extremely chill dude - “Love Thy Neighbor” and all of that - so it’s not his fault that after his death people later abuse his name to gain personal power, using it to do things like diddle children, which is vehemently NOT what “love thy neighbor” meant there!?!?!?!
Star Trek shows us a world where we can rise above all that:-). A famous person semi-recently said: “when they go low, we go high”.
Rule 1 is “No bigotry,” and trying to force rules and speech limitations imposed by your own religion onto those who don’t share them seems like a pretty bigoted thing to do.
I would love to argue back - e.g. I never tried to “force” anything here, I did not submit a report/complaint, nor have I downvoted a single item across this entire thread, I merely shared my own thoughts etc. - but you are coming to this conversation too late: I already see that people are not able to offer rational discourse on this particular subject matter, which is far too emotionally charged.
I have no love for religion when it has killed people in my community and when it has been used to spit hate in my face, as a gay man, on a constant basis throughout my life. I am certainly not going to be respecting one of their 10 Commandments in not taking the lords name in vain when they don’t respect the commandments in loving thy neighbor. I do not respect a religion that does not respect me. It is as simple as that. This is a two way street and the oppressed and scapegoated minority is definitely not the one who should make the first move. Especially when “Do not take the lords name in vain” could be applied to a trillion other things, such as using the Lords name to justify support for a party of hateful bigots that stand antithetical to everything the bible claims Jesus to be. Wanna make clear, I’m talking about religion as a whole there and not specifically religious people. It’s just hard to reconcile as a gay guy.
I wrote Rule 1, it doesn’t really apply here because Jesus Christ is a generalized swear. It’s not used as an anti-Christian epithet. It’s not used as a form of hate speech in regards to the religion or the people who use it. It’s an expression of extreme surprise. It wasn’t used in regards to Christians or in specific to them. Didn’t attack them, didn’t question them, didn’t refer to them. I said two words that have been used in this capacity for at least 200 years.
Lastly, the title is just quoting a movie. “Jesus Christ, it’s Jason Bourne.” And that’s one of the primary reasons why I definitely don’t care about using the phrase. There aren’t really any protections for it in media outside of normal swearing. It’s been adopted into the main stream as an expression of frustration. Religion has little to do with it anymore.
It certainly has done all that you said are more… religious fascists even killed Jesus himself, then others turned around to use him as a martyr for their own cause. Jesus the idea can be a bit like Santa Claus - it can mean whatever the fuck you want it to, especially if you can gain something (profits, power, gratification, etc.) as a result?
Regardless, I like how welcoming this community is. We can do yet still more though, to avoid “othering” half the people on planet earth? (Muslims also consider Jesus as one of the Holy Prophets, and similarly to Christianity makes up 1/4th-1/3rd of all people; Hindi is much more of a stretch but they too incorporate Jesus Christ into the pantheon of various “gods” and “avatars” and the like…; and too there are Mormons, who consider themselves Christians even while mainstream Christians do not in return, and on and on it goes - there really are a lot of people who at least claim to follow what Jesus says!)
Btw - you will enjoy this one, I think, even though it is not all that relevant to this discussion imho - that isn’t what taking the lord’s name in vain means. Mostly, as far as I’ve heard, that is “claiming his name” (calling yourself by a form of it?) yet denying all the great responsibility that comes with it. i.e., it is the very self-professed Christians who in the act of demeaning you (“treat others as you would wish to be treated in return”?), were the ones performing the very act of “taking HIS name”, but “in vain”. It’s just a fucking swear man, not a commandment-breaker, don’t sweat it:-).
That said, when I was growing up, the F-bomb (YOU KNOW WHICH ONE) was a generalized swear. It was also a short-form word for a cigarette? And on top of that, partially reclaimed by some within the target community, much as the N-word. Do you see how none of that matters? I had to expend SO MUCH effort to throw away my false religious roots (Will & Grace on TV helped so much with that:-P ngl I could not stand to watch it especially when 2 men kissed - I FORCED myself to watch, over and over again, to get past the idea that it was “not normal” or “unacceptable” or “morally wrong”). So please believe me when I say: that it made up a general swear for so long is nowhere near an excuse. Whatever THEY do is on them, while what WE do is on US. Yes, fuck religious Christo-fascists who instead of lifting a finger to help someone go extremely out of their way to heap heavy burdens upon other people (btw those are Jesus’ very own words - in Matthew 23:4)… but regardless of the past, who have we decided to be, here, in this place, at this time?
If it’s a direct quote from a movie… that actually might be a good counter-argument. Except wait a minute, if I used that argument in order to say the F-bomb word, or the N-word, would you (or the current mods I guess) allow me to get away with that then? Whether you/they did or did not, you should not, is what I am saying. Because it “others” people. See also my reply to the other comment below my prior reply.
Who have we decided to be, here, in this place, at this time?
Not Christian.
I am not stopping my usage of that phrase. Ever. I’ll limit it around people who are uncomfortable by it, but I’m not going to stop using it because I do not respect a religion that does not respect me. I refuse to play by rules that others do not. I refuse to limit myself based off of the whims of a few when the whims of those few killed my people for years.
Christians are not an oppressed minority. They do not get special treatment and I am honestly nearing ‘enraged’ territory because my entire life I’ve been told to fit into the mold of Christians. Whether it’s how I talk, how I act, the people I love… it doesn’t matter. And now you’re telling me that I can’t say an extremely common phrase that is used by Christians because it might upset them? No. Simply no. The entire religion upsets me by its simple existence and insistence that I am not a real person or that I am less of one.
That’s the thing I really need to hammer home to you. Christians are everywhere. Y’all get say in everything, including how children are raised. What stores are open when. What things are taught in school. What politicial motivation a candidate has. Frankly, you have too much power and you have too much say. I have had to curtail so much in my life or suffer the hatred and ostricazation of Christians that I am simply not going to bow and curtail to Christians in my language. If you don’t like it, tough. I don’t like your entire religion and the fact that it has killed so many of people, driven them to suicide, stunted children, gotten them molested, the list goes on and on and on and on and on and on and I’m only talking about shit that I personally have had to deal with from either personal experiences with creepy as fuck priests, creepy Christians, heavy parents that shamed my gay friends into taking their own lives, etc.
You’re not changing my opinion. Ever. Christians do not deserve special treatment when the entire institution refuses to give it to other people.
And trying to compare “Jesus Christ” to “Fag” had me actively say outloud “ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME” so I’m going to need to go calm down now. One of those is a phrase that is used in media. The other is a word that was yelled in my face when someone stabbed me.
They do not fucking equate. When was the last time Christians were rounded up and summarily beaten to death in a dark alley while having Jesus Christ yelled in their face? When was the last time one was strung up to a fence and beaten then left exposed to the elements after having that yelled in their face? When was the last time that Christians were bullied walking down the streets holding hands with someone else having that yelled in their face? When was the last time that Christians had fear of telling other people they were Christians because they’d lose their jobs, their families, their friends, their homes? I am actually shaking with rage.
You are great at community building. You have built a FANTASTIC place here. In all of our conversation, I hope I haven’t come across TOO awfully adversarial here? I felt like I was sharing my own, differing perspective, and naively even thinking in my head that I was HELPING by pointing this out… but of course my own perspective is not the only one that matters - any communication involves both a sending and a receiving, and I can only imagine your side of it, inside of my head.
It sounds like you are saying that “they deserve it”. My point: so what? Talking that way does not demean them, it only conveys your own anger, directed at them. Some people were outright killed, so I understand that… although even so, painting an entire religion by the actions of a few is dicey.
Also, you really disliked “the old place” (I mean the one on StarTrek.website, not Reddit), because of the unwritten rules that were selectively enforced (and out of that pain was birthed this new one, which is much more welcoming, I agree and I love it!!!). This is why I am such a fan of transparency - and if it is okay to make fun of Christians, then put that in the sidebar, but if not then… why is that okay, not the making fun of them part but the part about doing it but not being transparent about that?
To clarify: I am not trying to tell you what to do in any way, shape or form? I am merely sharing with you my perspective, in case it helps illuminate your own thinking. If that causes stress in your brain, then there may be a reason for that, and you may be happier to spend time untangling the reason why, to lead a more Zen lifestyle where such cares no longer intrude upon your thoughts and weigh you down? But if not, then those defenses are likely in place for a reason, and moreover perhaps on some other day you could have but maybe you cannot handle that right now, especially with… (waves hands) all of this going on in the USA right now? I get that, I don’t know how to convey just how MUCH I DO get that!
But fwiw, you are not correct imho. It doesn’t matter if they deserve it. It doesn’t matter if they are the minority or majority. Nobody is asking for “special treatment”, I was pointing out the differential treatment that selectively they seem to be getting - this is a safe space for people of all walks of life, except for some reason that one, that “other” one that you do not care for, because they hurt you. FUCK THEM for that btw, I am angry on your behalf! Though it does - should - not matter.
Do as you please, of course! I just thought I would open my big mouth and insert my thoughts where I was not invited:-P. I did think it could help… but how you choose to receive all of this is up to you. And I DO GET IT - they messed with you, and it is now hard to forgive. But since you asked…? No, you “can’t” say that extremely common phrase, and also have this remain a safe and open and welcoming space to the people that you are denigrating by doing so. That is not me, not my “perspective”, that is just how words work. Hurting them in return… will not bring you peace, nor engender a welcoming environment (I mean here retaining the one that already exists). That’s just my two cents, unasked-for as it was. I am sorry for your pain, I truly am, and I hope that one day you heal from it and move on past the bigots. (If it helps, many Christians think that nobody is a real person - they are super judgemental of EVERYONE, think “my child intensifies” vibes, but that is just how they choose to live, it has nothing whatsoever to do with you. I hope you can be free of that one day.)
As for what stores are open when, what things are taught in school, that is rather “democracy”, not “Christianity”. Democracy has real problems, especially when people choose to remain uneducated. Christianity has a real problem too, in encouraging people to trust authority structures rather than think through issues on their own. Thus, the issue is not caused by Christianity, but the latter does exaggerate the issue and make the existing way worse. Even so, again, that is on them, while what we do is on us.
Christians are killed all the time, but anyway this seems neither the time nor the place to get too deep into all of that - but if it helps, yes Christians are killed, not so much in the USA obviously. Hatred and bigotry exists everywhere in the world, it is part of our human nature, it just takes different forms in different local areas, each according to whatever excuses the people currently in power there try to use to weild their authority over others. Highly ironically, Jesus himself is a perfect example: for daring to say that the religious zealots of the day should actually bother to help people instead of merely claiming to do so while actually doing the opposite. But not recently, not in the USA, not locally here and now… although also not never, anywhere either. I have been consistently trying to argue that abuse of power is wrong, regardless of the target, or the reason.
I hope that helps explain what I was trying to convey. If you have more questions then I am happy to continue, but if this is merely causing you pain then perhaps I am not the right person to help you heal and see this point here, and we can stop? I want to be sensitive to your needs so I will simply trust your judgement here: just do not reply, or if you want the last word then as part of it tell me plainly that you want to stop, and I will drop it. Thank you for engaging with me so far - yes I agree that your pain is much greater than what I was saying you were feeding forward out to the world, so in that narrow aspect you are correct, I just hoped to help you see beyond that to what it might be like to leave all that behind us; though I must fully acknowledge my own limitations in that regard - I am most often not understood, and I take ownership of my lack of ability to communicate my thoughts. Conversely, I felt like it was not so “friendly” of me to remain silent either though, if I saw something that bothered me? So I offered, in friendliness, these thoughts. I apologize that it caused you pain. Yeah, fuck those that caused that originally… and I hope that you find a way to heal. I also hope that you stop feeding forward those divisive modes of thought, that were so forcibly pushed onto you, again at a much higher degree of severity that you now push out to “others”, but fwiw I do see that you need to heal first before you can do so. I hope you get there, I really do!:-D
This entire comment is predicated off of a false assumption.
It sounds like you are saying that “they deserve it”.
No. I am saying that they do not deserve protections of speech as Christians are not a oppressed minority but the oppressive majority. I’m not seeing the difference between “Jesus Christ” being called a slur or somehow derogatory towards Christians and some some white supremacist claiming that “Cracker” is a slur.
You’re also putting far too much emphasis on what you think that I feel instead of asking for clarification. This is also deeply bothering me because I do not fucking care about Christianity. It isn’t a concern of mine nor something that drifts across my thoughts. I do not think about it. I do not change my life for it. It’s a fairy tale that was invented thousands of years ago to get people to listen to basic rules and has turned into a tool of extreme hatred and oppression. So forgive me if I have little patience or care for the entire institution. I’m not saying it out of malice. I’m saying it because I don’t fucking care. I do not consider Christianity because it does not consider me.
and if it is okay to make fun of Christians, then put that in the sidebar
Once again. You are really sounding like a white supremacist claiming that “cracker” is somehow a slur. It is not “making fun of Christians” to say Jesus Christ. It simply isn’t. You can be upset by it all you want, and that’s valid to be upset by it, but you do not get to reframe reality so that your personal feelings on the matter override how things work. Saying “Jesus Christ!” is not a swear, it is not a curse, it is not hatred directed at someone. It is an exclamation of surprise or bewilderment. It is not mocking of Christianity but you suggesting that a literal slur that, when spoken, is evidence of a hate crime feels pretty fucking mocking of my community and everything we’ve gone through.
Christians are killed all the time, but anyway this seems neither the time nor the place to get too deep into all of that - but if it helps, yes Christians are killed, not so much in the USA obviously. Hatred and bigotry exists everywhere in the world, it is part of our human nature, it just takes different forms in different local areas, each according to whatever excuses the people currently in power there try to use to weild their authority over others.
And in no instance or example of that was “Jesus Christ!” ever said during it as a slur or hatred. The worst you can argue is that someone said “You believe in Jesus Christ!” It was never used as a swear. No one says “You Jesus Christ!” It is not a term used in hatred but a term used in surprise and I am beyond furious at you daring to suggest that Christians being killed for their religion is even remotely comparable to gay people being disowned by their families, being evicted, being killed, killing themselves, etc
I’m not even going to bother responding to the rest of your comment. You’ve made way too many assumptions about my opinions, my stances and my feelings without asking for clarification. You’ve compared the usage of “Jesus Christ” as a remark of exclamation to a word that is said in spitting venom, hatred, and is used during hate crimes. These are not the same and you have managed to offend me so severely in even suggesting that they are that I had to outright leave my fuckin house and walk away for a while before I broke shit and also guaranteed I’m never going to interact with you ever again. I do not appreciate people trying to compare hate crimes with a phrase spoken casually on a daily basis by Christians.
Also, what would Jesus have preferred here? Seriously? That someone use his name as an exclamation of surprise or that someone compare using his name as an exclamation of surprise with the poor, weak, downtrodden upon and victimized who have had to hear the word faggot spat in their face by people who were deemed their guardians and protectors? Because the Jesus I was raised on? He would have shrugged and said “They know not what they do.”
But I dunno. Maybe I read a different book.
Have a good day.
Jesus’ name is not on the same level as a slur. The two cannot be compared this way. I cannot take this comment seriously with that comparison. I’d write something longer than this but I just woke up. In short: wtf man.
You realize, of course, that you’re complaining about a use of language that is in fact most commonly used by Christian’s?
Hrm I did not know that but then all the more reason not to do it?
“Jesus Fucking Christ!” - just think about it for a moment, how is that “okay”? Perhaps when they do it one could arguably… no I can’t see it even then. But I will think about it some more.
So, like, you’re acting like you’re being persecuted here.
this is not that.
It’s a simple fact that the majority of people using some form of “jesus” as an exclamation are Christians and they’re not being prejudicial towards themselves.
I am not going to obey your religious proscriptions. I’m certainly not going to be too bothered by it when you’re proscriptions are particularly rare, even among people who broadly share your faith.
If you want to be offended, that’s your problem. Insisting others modify their behavior is not appropriate. Especially since you’re equating it to “Christian’s are being killed.”
Fucking hell. You’re not being persecuted here. Probably not even wherever you are. And I’d be willing to bet you don’t know anyone who’s been killed because they were a Christian. Take a beat and chill.
I do not feel persecuted. I don’t like seeing “others” get ragged on, regardless. I should clarify: individuals who deserve it absolutely should get railed on; the distinction is when the ragging moves above the stage of the individual and to an entire class of individuals. The literal definition of a bigot is “One who is narrow-mindedly devoted to their own ideas and groups, and intolerant of (people of) differing ideas, races, genders, religions, politics, etc.” I did not make this definition up, nor it seems can I explain it to someone who does not want to know (as your hand-picking of some of my answers to directed questions, ignoring the larger context, would seem to to indicate: I know, reading is hard sometimes), so I will stop here. You may chalk it up to simply a misunderstanding or… whatever you like, I suppose.
I’m more of a “Christ on a cracker” man in polite company, or “fuck me sideways” otherwise.
I don’t discern between polite and impolite society, it’s demeaning. Therefore I’ll use “Jesus fuck” regardless of situation, with very few exceptions on a per diem basis.
Have you ever thought about why you include his name though? Merely bc that’s how it’s been done before? Why not just say “fuck”? (I am partial to “oh fuck me” personally) Surely the inclusion of the name signifies something, whether you personally thought it through or not?
And then more importantly is how it makes others around you feel. If I were to say “damn those gays” every time I was angry… without ever questioning why, then would that similarly be allowable? Even if I had never so much as met a gay person in my life, and none of the people overhearing me was gay, and let’s further stipulate the highly unlikely scenario that I was not even aware of what the term meant. The word “gay” actually does have meaning to people, generally speaking, as too does “Jesus”, it’s not simply an expletive - it has a whole history and backstory that just about everyone in the world is aware of.
This feels different though. I may be inadequate at explaining but I will try. Both of those involve a juxtaposition of things that are normal but are odd when conjoined: fucking + … sideways? Christ but… as peanut butter?
Calling out a proper name as in “JFC man!” is more like “oh no, somebody pulled a joey!” (or conversely, “watch out - she’s a Karen!”, MY CHILD vibes intensify…:-P). It specifically pulls up the name, in an intentionally derogatory manner. Thereby it is “cheap”, as it ties in to the aforementioned “othering” effect - which is POWERFUL in its allure and an ever-present bias making up human thought patterns, and therefore needs to be watched out for or it will suck us in.
Ironically I would be okay if this community added an exemption to its rules, like “no othering of a group - unless the group in question is Christianity, because fuck those people, amirite?!:-P” What I cannot stand though is when something like this “sneaks through”. Beehaw does a fantastic job at explaining who they are - with not only mere sidebar text but multiple pages of a help document detailing what the rules are, and how they will be enforced. Likewise, Blåhaj does a fantastic job of not only talking the talk but then walking out that walk, i.e. “please bear in mind that this is a server that is very protective of our minority members and bigotry of any variety will be squashed with great prejudice.” In contrast, this community says “generally “othering” of a group will result in removal/ban.” - except, again, unless the target in question is one of those that the people in power happen to disagree with, I guess?
This is not very Star Trek of us, imho. It does not matter if Christianity is deserving of respect or not - there are a lot of historical reasons pointing to… well… both sides yay and nay there - but what matters is how we treat people - ideally with a spirit of outright welcomingness to all, but failing that, at least with equity and fairness? (or at the very minimum, I would hope, transparency)
While in theory this all sounds wonderful, in practice, at least in this case, I’d say you’re making a mountain out of a molehill.
I am only middle-aged, but this comment makes me feel “old” for the first time in my entire lifetime. Or rather, the thoughts that it evokes does. I remember when the MeToo movement came out, and people said the same thing then. Likewise the racist comments before them. Likewise the anti-LGTBTQI+ comments that I have heard over the course of my entire life. “Get over it, it’s not that bad”, “people are just having a bit of fun, it has nothing to do with you, f**got”, and so on.
Elsewhere I have heard on this thread “it’s not happening”, “okay fine it’s happening but it’s okay”, “okay it’s not okay but so what”… and I remember ALL of this, e.g. from Trump’s first (and second) impeachment trials. This event quantitatively is not even in the same ballpark as that… but that’s not the point. Are we welcoming here or not?
In return I offer that famous quote: “First they came for…” - i.e., if something is true, and moves in a trajectory that will lead to a bad end, even if only slowly, then isn’t that bad, regardless of the speed? I am glad that you do not feel called out, although I wonder why not? If something is directed at someone - anyone - then why are we okay with that, even if we are not the target? Whether anyone in particular takes offense at it or not, wouldn’t the mere fact that people might be offended sufficient reason to stop using it? When I was a kid people would say “ohhhh… gross, man that is so gay” - but you know what, after GREAT efforts, we (as a culture) stopped saying that, it is possible to change language! We did it, out of respect for the LGBTQIA+ community. When I was young we also would hear things like “man, don’t be such a pussy”, or even outright “don’t be such a girl” - this too seems to have stopped? Is being gay wrong? No, but is saying that something is “so gay”, meaning it in a bad way wrong? YES! Is being a girl wrong? No, but is saying that a boy is “being a girl” wrong? YES! Is being a Christian wrong… ? Suddenly shit gets more real with this one, yo. Let’s even say for the sake of argument that it is… so what? Are we going to divide into camps on this issue, like with every other issue (the Left always eats its own), or are we going to be “welcoming” and stop “othering” people so that everyone feels okay to visit here? I feel like I know what Captains Kirk and Picard would do - even at great cost to themselves in the process. But on that, I acknowledge that I could be wrong. (Janeway of course would have already killed me for having spoken up, and then turned my blood into coffee:-P)
(A valid counter-argument might have included b/c the group in question is in power, and it is okay to punch up - now that I could have gotten behind, although ironically this is the one argument that I have not heard yet. It at least displays an acknowledgement that the “punching” is in fact taking place.)
TLDR:
You’re equating someone saying “Jesus Christ” as an expletive with rape. You are out of line. As the kids say, go touch some grass.
You lost me there. I have no idea where you think that “rape” came from in my statement? Perhaps from mentioning MeToo? That was about way more than just rape - lower wages, in general a culture of not being believed, e.g. when saying what men did, which yes included rape but a whole host of lesser things as well.
As far as touching grass, yes I will do that! In case that is a signal that you want to end this friendly conversation, I will do so. I just wanted to say my piece that hatred and intolerance is never okay, regardless of someone’s personal feelings about the target. I am not sure why that is so controversial… especially in this community of all places, but okay.
Hey, I’m sorry that “Jesus Christ” as an expletive feels alienating to you. I hadn’t thought about that perspective. As a lifelong atheist my feeling is that Christianity, and by extension blasphemous expletives, are so thoroughly enmeshed in Western culture that that’s what comes out when I’m startled. I don’t feel like I’m using the words to show distaste for another group; I feel like the words are part of my culture even though I’m not religious. My guess is that saying"Jesus Christ" is generally not intended to be a statement on Christians. But I can see how someone who is religious might see it differently. I suppose lots of people see their relationship with Jesus as a part of their identity that distinguishes them from people who don’t believe, and from that perspective I can see how a perceived attack on Jesus feels like a personal attack.
I’ll also mention that since I didn’t have a religious upbringing I was never taught to have any particular reaction to blasphemy, which tends to make me see those expletives as less-offensive alternatives to scatological or sexual expletives. I don’t have a good perspective of what such language feels like to someone who was taught that blasphemy is bad.
And why not add one more paragraph - I agree that when I view him as a moral philosopher and proto-socialist I find a lot of what Jesus said and did to be admirable.
Well, something to consider is that as an exclamation, “Jesus” etc started among Christians as an invocation of protection, not as an expletive. Same as “oh my god!”. We’ve kind of dropped the second part for brevity, (“save me!”)
In the way we use it, it’s usually more of an exclamation than an expletive, but, eh, as far as which is more offensive, it’ll always depend on who you’re talking to- even between Christians
I find it the height of irony how the class of people that Jesus hated most were hypocritics - calling them “den of vipers” and even more descriptive “like whitewashed tombs, looking good only on the outside but on the inside full of rot and decay”.
Jesus hung out with prostitutes and “tax collectors” - today that would be LGBTQIA+ and homeless or renters rather than landlords - and argued for women’s rights.
In America the people who showed up to overthrow the government on January 6th called themselves “patriots”, and similarly people say how they “follow the teachings of Christ”. But… how trustworthy are the people saying this?
Anyway, I’ve been a bit of everything in my life from Christian to Atheist and several forms of in-between, but regardless of my personal thoughts about the actual subject mainly what I was saying above was about the meta-subject of the wording causing “othering” and making people feel welcomed. Not people who “follow Christ” by like diddling kids (aka who do NOT do that, whatever they claim), and rather people who regardless of whether they do the former, find the latter repugnant, yet can come from a wide variety of backgrounds (including other varieties of non-mainstream Christianity such as Mormon, or Muslims also consider Jesus as one of the Holy Prophets).
I would not like to see people making fun of gay people. Or women (or men). So why is it okay to make fun of Christians? And not merely the hypocritical Christo-fascists, but all Christians (and again, also Mormons, Muslims, etc.)? Even the ones feeding & helping to house the homeless, or the ones who fought to end slavery in the UK? It’s easier to build a community by “othering” the outsiders, by making everything about “us versus them”. I’m watching the Republicans in the USA do that right this very weekend, ending much of the spending programs for things such as healthcare and science, and when asked they can’t even say why really, except that they need to “pwn the libs”.
Which makes me think that it’s not enough to be against something - we need to be for something. One thing this very community is for is inclusivity, creating a safe and not merely tolerant but outright welcoming space for people to come and chat. Unless, that is, you are part of that “other” group, over “there”.
That does not make me feel good. How does it make you feel?
![[Car Talk with Martok] Jesus Christ, it's a Straight Line!](https://media.piefed.world/posts/nI/pU/nIpU7C1BvH4Q3nq.jpg){kind=link}